Thailand is proud of the fact that they were never colonized,
though now they’re jealous of the very countries that were, because they had an increased opportunity to learn English. Thais are crazy about English so they absorb it into their language as fast as possible, though they speak it terribly. Go figure. As the Encyclopedia Britannica reports, “Thailand colonized themselves.” Thais like to talk about you behind your back right to your face. That’s all the revenge they need to maintain their self-esteem. Generic Asian Singapore is the role model, a mangle of tongues and twisted routes, lost in the quest for material possessions, found in the supermarkets of a future world.
lavandula, 
hkarges, and 11 others are discussing. 
streaming consciousness... 
aumja24 9:29 am on August 17, 2008 Permalink |
hi
sabine 11:57 pm on August 22, 2008 Permalink |
Reading this blog I get the impression the author does not like Thais or Thailand that much.
lavandula 9:22 pm on November 11, 2012 Permalink |
so agreed…. writer should be transparent and not shows his ‘dislikes’ thru his educational medium…
hkarges 10:10 am on August 23, 2008 Permalink |
That’s not true. I have lived in Thailand ten years and have a Thai wife and would almost go so far as to say it saved my life. But the facts are the facts, and Thailand is a wacky, if wonderful, place. There are also many things about Thailand I don’t like, chief among them pathetically low educational levels and false vanity (read Pico Iyer). Hopefully honest criticism can have positive results. I was born in Mississippi, so this is an old subject, love/hate relationships. Thanks for your comment.
peter 8:47 am on October 22, 2008 Permalink |
hey, im thai and i speak fluently 5 languages.. lived in about 4 countries.. now actually living in france.. going to college next year.. love my country more than anything.. please dont put all thais in one bag.. or if u really wanna talk about thais.. go and say it infront of them! in the middle of Siam.. im sure they’ll be more than happy to listen to your remarks..
hkarges 6:55 am on October 23, 2008 Permalink |
I am saying it in front of them, aren’t I? I have extensive discussions with my wife on all these subjects frequently, though my gentle poking could never pop the over-inflated balloon that is Thai pride. It’s an obstacle to the truth. Taksin used the same ‘Rao rak Thai’ words on his triumphant return a few months ago and my wife sucked it up, quoted him constantly. Now where is he?
I consider Carabao one of the greatest rock bands of all time, and have even adapted some of their songs to English for Aet’s perusal. I promote them constantly in my other blog http://thailand-to-timbuktu.blogspot.com/, at no benefit to myself btw, but their excessive and pandering nationalism is silly. Great art and great thought speak to universal themes.
You’ve lived in four countries, now starting college? I’ve probably spent more time in Thailand than you, though no reason for either of us to get defensive. Peter is not a Thai name btw. You should love your country, though the truth never hurt anyone, and that quote about ‘Thailand colonizing themselves’ comes from Encyclopedia Britannica, not me. I love Thailand btw.
p.s. Your accomplishments and experience in the world are duly noted. I wish the best of luck to you.
Lalida 1:54 am on December 16, 2008 Permalink |
Hi,
i accidetally came across your blog and i was no so impressed by which you had written about my country.Frankly,such kinds of people you said above are everywhere in this world,including Mississipi I suppose.It quite unfair ,regarding to “your”stereotype toward Thai people. I don’t know what kind of traveler you are neither what kind of book you wrote.If you have time I suggest you to take a sociology course which might help broaden your global knowlegde in order to have more understanding way toward other people beside yourself, no offend.
If you live in Thailand for ten years and have a Thai wife like you said,I am amazed by how you see our country such in a negative point of views.Oh, try to open your mind as well.
Thanks!
hkarges 6:10 am on December 16, 2008 Permalink |
I have taken a sociology course, I assure you, and have traveled in over fifty countries and counting. My goal is not to offend, but to enlighten, however feeble my efforts. I realize that Thais are extremely sensitive to criticism. That’s part of the point I make. A national superiority complex does no one any good, whether it be the US or Thailand. It’s simply another form of racism.
Kerim 10:39 am on March 31, 2009 Permalink |
The title and the description is so true and predictable.
I agree with your opinion Hkarges. I am half Thai and I live in Bangkok. Thai people are usually slow to understand what you say.
Oscar 5:08 pm on August 21, 2009 Permalink |
“I am saying it in front of them, aren’t I?”
ummmm, no, you’re not. You’re using your computer as your facade to protect yourself from the public. It is the same as “to talk about you behind your back right to your face”, that’s what you’re doing. And in my dictionary, that what you call a hypocrite. You farangs are all the same. If you have so much negativity towards Thailand, please don’t force yourself to stay as your attitude is not welcome.
I’m a Thai person living in the US, and what you say about Thai people is pretty subjective. You seem to be judging every Thai person and putting them in the same category. That’s pretty ignorant. In Los Angeles, there are people as what you describe, and guess what, 60-70% of it are from farangs as yourself. Before you blurt out BS, makes sure you’re not one of the BS.
Have a great day farang one. 🙂
hkarges 1:02 am on August 22, 2009 Permalink |
You just confirmed every point I ever wished to make, which wasn’t very much btw, just a simple observation that Thais are obsessed with their national image. Of course all opinions are subjective. “You farangs are all the same,” now that’s racist. I never said anything like that, nor will I. I’m not welcome where, LA? Why are you in LA if you love Thailand so much and “You farangs are all the same”? I love Thailand and defend its reputation constantly. I just think it’s a bit wacky in some ways and think others may find these observations interesting, just like hundreds of Thai journalists do all the time with their comments on America.
Oscar 7:40 pm on August 23, 2009 Permalink
The reason I live in America is because I was born here, my parents moved from Thailand to america and became citizens. I’m finishing up college, so i will be moving to Thailand later.
rachman 10:28 am on October 27, 2009 Permalink |
Hello, I also accidentally visited your blog as well… and I just think that this particular video might be interesting for you all who’ve posted anything on this page… Sorry for the bad quality of the video, but please just try watching it, it’s really worth watching, beside that, it’s also very enjoyable!
Sofie 3:25 am on December 8, 2009 Permalink |
I’m a Thai-American with mixed ancestry, but mostly identify as ethnically Thai, nationally American. I was born in California and lived here most of my life, and I have spent 2 years living in Thailand.
Now that I’ve made that introduction, it’s time to get to the point.. I agree with Hkarges 100 percent. Thais have a strong sense of nationalistic pride that is so sensitive to the slightest of remarks. I’m not saying all of them, but generally the overall population is a very proud one. They have every right to be, but sometimes their inflated sense of country can go beyond reason. I love Thailand and the Thai people, but I cannot love every aspect. As an outsider and living in America most of my life, I will have my share of opinions. You Thais can have your share of opinions about Americans as well. Will it upset me? Hell no.
You may think of us as you please, true or not. If it’s an outrageous assumption I’ll correct you, but I for the most part won’t take much offense to what you Thais have to say about Americans. Why? Because I was raised with this beautiful thing we call FREEDOM OF SPEECH. I’m used to people freely stating their opinions without oppression. You Thais probably are as well, but not to the extent that other cultures are. For example, in Thailand it is considered unacceptable to criticize the king, even in a joking way. Of course, I believe the king is very deserving of all the respect Thai people give him and he should not be made fun of, but more than anything I believe people should have the right to say WHATEVER they want about him, or anything else for that matter.
What I noticed here is that Hkarges made extremely minute criticisms about the Thai people while also addressing the fact that he loves the Thai people and their land, but Thais here STILL think he is being offensive. He is NOT. There is absolutely nothing wrong with seeing some flaws in an overall beautiful thing. It seems to me, at least on the posts made here, that Thai people cannot tolerate any form of negative opinion or criticism regarding themselves.
I am American and am able to see the beauty in my country as well as the ugly that has plagued it for years. I am not blind. I know why I love it and I know why it needs to change. I know the stereotypes made about my people and sometimes they humor me as well! I am able to distinguish the good and the bad, what I like and what I don’t like. I am pleased to say that I am more of myself than my country. I accept criticism from anyone of any race, ethnicity, and nationality. We are all equals as men and women and our countries should not define us. We may love our countries and defend our countries, but we should not be arrogant, egotistic fools whose fuses go off easily from a tiny, little opinion from another.
We all have our own views. Allow other people to have theirs.
Sofie 3:41 am on December 8, 2009 Permalink |
Also, onto a less serious note.. I do agree with Thais talking behind your back in front of you. I lived in Thailand for 2 years (I’m still young, a teenager in fact..) and I went to a Thai school for a months or so. The kids there would talk about me behind my back IN FRONT OF ME. It hurt my feelings quite a bit. If you’re going to be a bitch and talk about me behind my back, I suggest you wait until I’m out of hearing range at least. And if you want me to know what you think about me, say it to me directly to my face than talk about it someone else while I’m listening. This is one of the things I absolutely dislike about many Thai people (not all).
Overall, I love Thai people and Thailand.
Is it wrong of me to have this view? Not at all.
CAL 9:22 am on December 9, 2009 Permalink |
Are you done?
If so, what you said are all BS. Just use the MS. Word and do “replace all” the word Thai/Thailand with American/US. It make no different… if you know what I mean… peace!
If you do not sensitive with this issue.. why bother?.. this is hypocrite… in the very obvious and simple way.. try harder!
hkarges 9:35 pm on December 12, 2009 Permalink
Is that you, ‘Oscar’? What issue? THERE IS NO ISSUE! NO ONE IS TRYING TO MAKE ANY JUDGMENT ABOUT THAI VS. ‘FARANG’- EXCEPT YOU! You have real personal issues you need to deal with, ‘CAL’, and the sooner the better so that you can enjoy life. Blaming your problems on ‘farangs’ is not the solution. I have a feeling that you’re a very intelligent person, and your energies could be better spent on other things than lashing out at what you mistakenly perceive as slights on your national character. I personally believe that personal character is much more important- THAT’S MY POINT! Life can sometimes be difficult; don’t make it any more so than it has to be. I wish you the best. If that’s ‘BS’, then so be it.
Sofie 5:01 pm on December 14, 2009 Permalink |
Jeez. Is it soooooo wrong to have ANY criticism at all about Thais? Someone answer this for me.
Hkarges is right. I am me. I am not my country. I am NOT my parent’s country.
We are above any flag that can label us or strip us of our individuality.
CAL 10:13 am on January 2, 2010 Permalink |
Hkarges,
No, I am not Oscar.
And sorry for my temper… I am just not feel right when somebody making any criticism to someone else and CANNOT reason back others’ critic about their criticism… what an irony…
I do not mind at all about your points on Thailand colonizing herself.. and also agreed in many points you made… but some of them are just…. not so right… and I need to critic you back… and that’s the end of the story.
To make myself clear, for example, if I also said,
“Jeez. Is it soooooo wrong to have ANY criticism at all about XXXs?
We are above any flag that can label us or strip us of our individuality.”
Make no different! So, this kind of sentences can be just removed from this article (no offend to Sofie.. sorry.. but I mean in general)… and your article (Thailand colonized themselves) is now good to read again….
hkarges 10:40 am on January 3, 2010 Permalink |
Sorry for lumping you with Oscar, CAL, I honestly thought you were the same person coming from two different e-mail addresses. So you’re accusing me of dishing out criticism and not being able to take it? Now that IS a situation loaded with irony, isn’t it? Just for the record: 1) Aside from the pathetic education system there (any defenders?), I have no specific criticisms of Thailand, only a broad general one that is far less important to me than my overall affection for the place and its people, 2) this blog is intended for entertainment, NOT sociological critique, and in my wildest dreams, perhaps, a glimmer of enlightenment, 3) any and all comments are welcome as long as they are polite, including the avoidance of racial epithets and slurs. Considering that the word ‘farang’ could be considered as such, I suppose I could be accused of showing favoritism toward the nationals of my adopted country for allowing them, as I certainly wouldn’t allow any of the more common ones for Asians. I’m a nice guy, but I also have ulterior motives. The fact that someone born in America- or even an immigrant, would use that word- or even KNOW it, says far more than any of my humble scribblings. That’d be like me going to Africa and talking about ‘niggers.’ Racism is Thailand’s ‘dirty little secret’. Fortunately it’s not usually the vicious kind, just ignorance, and a little surprising considering the number of people with Chinese grandfathers. Is that enough irony for you? Racism is something to be condemned in all its forms, something I learned long ago in my home state of Mississippi, which should be PROUD of its African heritage, not merely tolerant of it. America’s great strength is its diverse mix of peoples and origins, and the more the better. Racism can only be ended by ending races, and that’s something that Thailand is apparently taking the lead in. You should be proud of your immigrant Westerners and so-called ‘luke kreungs’, too. There are no more social classes, and that’s something you learned in America. I just read on http://www.Thaivisa.com about a Thai teenage girl who killed herself because her Thai teacher told her parents about her boyfriend. Now THERE’S an issue worth discussing.
D 10:18 am on February 12, 2010 Permalink |
Ive just stumbled upon this blog and I found this entry really interesting. Im no Thai or American, and Ive never been to Thailand, so im not in the position to comment about Thais in general. But what I see from these two opposing views, here in this blog, is that the more Thais act like CAL or Oscar, the more hkarges proves to be correct. In a meaningful discussion, i dont see it right to throw the same punches when you are given criticism. Rather, prove him wrong. Yes, what hkarges sees about Thais arent necessarily exclusive to Thailand’s image — in fact the same negative can be applied to every other races/nationalities. But hkarges point here is to show where Thais could be (let me say it again: could be) wrong about themselves. Coming from not either of the two sides, I can see that the observations here about Thais arent made to insult anyone or any Thai.
Im going to Thailand in two weeks time, but the way Oscar and CAL demonstrated their behaviour kind of gives me bit of hint of what to expect when I get there. But of course, not all are like them, and any negative could be proven wrong when I get to know Thais more, personally.
You know what, this made my anticipation to see the land of the free just more immense!
hkarges 9:31 pm on February 18, 2010 Permalink |
Have a wonderful trip. Thailand is a wonderful place. The things discussed here should be of little or no concern to you.
albert 3:26 am on February 24, 2010 Permalink |
I agree what hkarges said about how pathetic the education system in Thailand is. I’m not an American nor Thai but I’m a teacher who experienced how worst is their educational practice. Since we are not allowed to “fail the students”,they were able to gamble their grades. Maybe because parents are rich and popular, their sons or daughters are spoiled especially in English programs in both Private or Public Schools.One of my co-teachers says that we need to help the students even though they are not interested in particular subject.Is that really helps? Parents could pay the school in order to let their kids proceed to the next level even if they can’t read or write on their own langauge. Okay let us say it is their practice.What if that student become a doctor? And you are his or her patient, what should you expect from him? How oould you trust him? I even experienced of sofie had, like talk about me behind my back IN FRONT OF ME.I ask one of the teachers, why are most of the Thais (not all) loves GOSSIP? She replied , “It’s our culture” . They hate confrontation.But after all those reason I still beleive that everywhere in the world, there are lots of Good things and Bad things like people around us.I still stick to the GOLDEN RULE.. ” Do not do unto others what you don’t want others do unto you.” PEACE to all of us !!!!!!
hkarges 5:13 am on February 24, 2010 Permalink |
No, the problem is not limited to parents buying their son’s grades. In my case, I caught my wife’s son cheating his math homework everyday, BECAUSE HE HAD A FRIEND WILLING TO DO IT FOR HIM! So of course he failed his tests. I tutored him in Math for three months, with some results, but the task was overwhelming and maybe too little too late. This was in Chiang Rai, so probably more problematic than the central region. The problems and solutions are intertwined. Thai education spends so much effort building nationalism that they ignore ABC’s and 1,2,3’s. As always, it’s up to the parents to instill the value of education, though girls have to fight for the right, even though they usually out-score the boys! Culture is written on paper, not in stone, and is changeable. Thailand is capable of that, but it takes time. Buddhist-inspired passivity is part of the problem. “Do good and good will come to you” is a fine life philosophy but not enough for youth. I prefer “work hard if you want to get ahead.” The golden rule always rules whether active ‘do’ or passive ‘don’t do.’ Thanks for your comments.
Ng Yih Miin 3:21 am on December 14, 2011 Permalink |
Ng Yih Miin…
[…]Thailand is proud of the fact that they were never colonized, « streaming consciousness[…]…
lavandula 11:21 pm on November 11, 2012 Permalink |
Too many campaigns and wars here…. as mine, i just can say Thailand is stil Thailand. According to Hkarges writing posted on August 15, 2008, Generic Asian Singapore is the role model, i agreed. agreed in the matter of how the politics and government handle the country. succeed. Anyway, do we ever think that why Thailand is stil Thailand? That is the secret that Thailand would never want to reveal yet or never want to reveal it forever to the world. As in Charlie and The Chocolate Factory line goes ‘who runs the factory because no one comes in, and nobody ever comes out… mystery’. Thailand is so rich land with sources. but why Thailand still remain their culture and politics…? and still succeed too… I left it in mystery….